• Welcome to Hair loss Experiences hair loss forum.

    Free impartial hair loss advice, hair transplant advice, hair loss medications and hair loss news.
    You can contact us directly at [email protected] if you experience any problems.

SMP by HIS HAIR 3 years on MY STORY

B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#1
I had full scalp SMP by HIS HAIR in winter 2016. It seems to have turned blue/green tint after 3 years. Any advice and support would be much appreciated. Prior to this, I had 2000 FUE with Dr Feriduni however, my donor area was not sufficient enough to cover my crown and bridge.

Please let me know your thoughts and suggestions. This has had an impact on me. Starting to think I'd rather be bald. ANY suggestions welcome.

Pics attached.
 

Attachments

B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#2
I had full scalp SMP by HIS HAIR in winter 2016. It seems to have turned blue/green tint after 3 years. Any advice and support would be much appreciated. Prior to this, I had 2000 FUE with Dr Feriduni however, my donor area was not sufficient enough to cover my crown and bridge.

Please let me know your thoughts and suggestions. This has had an impact on me. Starting to think I'd rather be bald. ANY suggestions welcome.

Pics attached.
I WOULD LIKE TO SHARE MY STORY.
I HAD 3 SESSIONS OF SCALP MICROPIGMENTATION WITH HIS HAIR IN LONDON IN 2016. THE TREATMENT WAS INITIALLY DARK, AND MATCHED MY HAIR COLOUR. I ASKED FOR A NATURAL BUT FULL HEAD OF HAIR LOOK. AS THE YEARS WENT ON, FAST FORWARD TO 2019. I NOTICED THE TREATMENT HAD TURNED A BLUE/GREENISH TINT AND THE INK WAS SATURATED. AS YOU CAN SEE IN MY PICTURES, I HAVE THE DREADED HELMET HEAD LOOK. THE DOTS WERE BECOMING BLOTCHY, JOINING TOGETHER. I WAS GETTING CALLED OUT EVERY WEEK BY MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC. I CANNOT EXPLAIN THE HUGE IMPACT THIS HAD ON ME PSYCHOLOGICALLY, THE IMPACT ON MY SELF CONFIDENCE, THE IMPACT ON MY FAMILY, MY WORK, MY DESIRE TO EVEN LEAVE MY HOUSE. I CAN NO LONGER LEAVE MY HOME WITHOUT A HAT. I SPOKE TO THE CEO OF HIS. I WAS TOLD THAT MY TREATMENT WAS NOT BAD AND THE CEO SAID HE HAD NOT SEEN THE PICTURES OF IT AND HOW IT HAD TURNED BLUE. THE CEO DID NOT WANT TO SEE MY PICTURES. I WAS OFFERED LASER SESSIONS AND HIS ASKED FOR A FURTHER 4 FIGURE SUM OF MONEY ON TOP OF THE £3000 I SPENT IN 2016. I HAD LASER TREATMENT WITH HIS WHICH HAD NO EFFECT NO FADING. I WAITED THE RECOMMENDED TIME FOR LASER TO KICK IN BUT I SAW NOTHING. I AM NOW ON A JOURNEY TO PUT THIS RIGHT AND HOLD HIS ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE PSYCHOLOGICAL DAMAGE AND TRAUMA THEY HAVE PUT ME THROUGH. THIS IS MY STORY.
I WOULD SAY TO ANYONE CONSIDERING SMP, PLEASE DO YOUR HOMEWORK. I THOUGHT I DID MINE. DOUBLE DOUBLE CHECK EVERYTHING. SPEAK TO CLIENTS THAT HAVE HAD THE PROCEDURE DONE IF YOU CAN, LOOK AT BEFORE AND AFTER PHOTOS. GO WITH YOUR GUT. BE WEARY OF BEFORE AND AFTER PICTURES POSTED MANY YEARS AGO THAT ARE STILL ON WEBSITES AS IF THEY WERE DONE RECENTLY. THIS IS PERMANENT INK. LASER IS PAINFUL AND IT IS A PROCESS TO REMOVE, THEN RE WORK.
 
bullitnut

bullitnut

4 awesome repairs with SMG
Likes
52
#3
Sorry to hear about your situation i can only begin to imagine what you must be going through right now. Who did your actual SMP as it seems way too dark to begin with even without the blue colour as you mentioned. The density looks way too dense as well which is likely the reason you have what you call the helmet look. I have seen SMP that is over ten years old up close so what your experiencing is certainly not what happens to everyone and likely a problem with either the ink used or the way the procedure has been done by the clinic. How did it look when it was first done were you happy then?

To want to charge a further £3000 to help solve a problem they caused is not good business sense imo as any sane person wouldn't just take that on the chin....it's really poor patient care and very unethical and they should at the very least try and help you for what as happened.

Did they give a reason why the laser treatment didn't work?
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#4
Thanks for reply.

When I first had it done it was not blue. It was dark and I was concerned about the temples being so sharp. I was told it would 'settle down' and fade to a lighter colour and would apparently look 'amazing'

I'd rather not name the practitioner, as they let another practitioner do some dots as well as the lead practitioner who was doing my smp. I totally agree about the ink. I gave the laser time but it actually made the dots worse. I waited out the laser cooldown. Furthermore, HIS do not use a freestanding 1064 ndyag laser anymore. They have a portable one that has a big gun instead of a 'pen' attached to a cable. I have seen these portable 1064 machines on ebay for £400

The pigment is so saturated and dense that I have had to seek independent advice by a company that specializes in removing SMP. Basically even a 1064 is not shifting my SMP so I am going with a better laser, without causing skin damage.

I have asked for my treatment money back plus cost of laser as their in house laser (they now say the laser guy is a separate company to HIS even though the laser is in HIS building) did not work, and they took 2 hours to laser my head. A whole scalp shouldn't take this long due to the pain and skin.

They wanted £1000 minimum for 2 sessions after laser to re work the SMP. I have no faith in HIS as they botched my SMP and botched my laser plus wanted more money to correct THEIR mistakes.

I am in the process of asking for a refund but I'm being ignored. This is what HIS are like. They refuse to accept they can do wrong and go on about how they created SMP.
 
bullitnut

bullitnut

4 awesome repairs with SMG
Likes
52
#5
Wow sounds like you've really been through it with them dude. His went down hill as soon as Paul Clark Simon Lane and Damon Ashcroft left imo and they have been struggling ever since as nobody can match their skills at HIS now and this just echoes my concerns. I hope you get things sorted one way or another I really feel for ya buddy.

Probably the reason why top clinics like Brandwood and Skalp etc have their own specialist inks if HIS ink is doing this?
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#6
This.

Everything you said is spot on. To get this off will take multiple laser sessions. HIS no longer use a freestanding laser. They have a smaller portable one they used on me. The laser guy at HIS was lasering my head for 2 hours. Whole scalp should take 30 mins maybe a bit more depending on number of breaks asked for.

HIS are using old before and after pictures even today. They have the other CEO doing SMP's now as they lack practitioners of the quality you describe, e.g. Award winning practitioners. But that CEO was not doing front line work when SMP evolved with 3d effect and such.

I have asked for every penny of the treatment back. And more importantly, I want to warn others to think carefully about jumping in to SMP before doing their homework.

It's going to be a long time before I can fix this, as even with the finest laser treatment the ink is very stubborn. Especially as it turned blue after 3 years.

My pics in pink T shirt are from April 2019 and the other from 2017
 
bullitnut

bullitnut

4 awesome repairs with SMG
Likes
52
#7
It's good that your warning others dude....I do feel for you but without sounding insensitive the hairline is also two sharp and therefore looks unnatural imo as it should be slightly feathered and not so straight looking and the temple points are way too sharp/defined.

Good luck the removal dude I wish you all the best pal.

Makes me mad seeing posts like this I hope you get fixed
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#8
I know bud. I never asked for THAT much definition. I asked for a full head of hair look but not to look like a vampire. They assured me it would 'fade' as in settle but that never happened. Instead it turned blue.

In 2017/18 I had a serious accident and family stuff to prioritise, so even though I knew it looked bad I had to get those things out the way first. Then in 2019 the damn thing turns BLUE, as in the pic.
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#9
I have heard via a former employee of HIS that HIS use Talens drawing Ink on their clients. Drawing ink says 'not for tattooing' on it. I have also discovered a couple of YouTube clips by SMP practitioners that using drawing ink is indeed being used. This explains why it is proving so hard to laser off.

The more respectable SMP providers use Alevio vegan ink, designed for smp.
 
bullitnut

bullitnut

4 awesome repairs with SMG
Likes
52
#10
Alevio is what Brandwood use....if I were in your shoes I'd be tempted to go see them as I'm sure they would have a solution or would know what's best to do. I believe they do laser too there.
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#11
We are on the same wavelength. Yes they refer to a certain laser clinic that specializes in SMP removal.

Even with the best lasers, even a picosure, breaking down the madness that is in HIS's ink is a process. I've seen well done SMP procedures, even dark pigments removed in 2 and in some cases 1 session. But whatever is inside HIS ink, is stubborn and it's a process.
 
scepticsausage

scepticsausage

member
Likes
10
#12
Some of those dots look huge still, i was under the impression they shrunk over time? Is the blueness all over the head or just patches?
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#14
It's looking slightly better now after 2 laser sessions. I got a threatening call from the CEO of HIS saying if I take my posts down on forums he'll give me free SMP. No way am I letting that sunk to the bottom of the ocean touch my head. He was swearing/cursing, threatening to blame his freelancers for the botched job even though it was done in a HIS CLINIC WITH A HIS CONTRACT HIS TOOLS AND HIS INK. He said he'll bend the truth and say that it's the work of his freelancers and HIS are not taking responsibility. He put words in my mouth saying when I complained, I said I was 'happy' with the treatment!
He was livid. I asked what ink he used and he said he can't tell me that due to health and safety and it's all FDA approved from USA.
He said that he trained all the best smp pracs and they all 'stole from him'

He refused me a refund saying he ain't giving me a refund so I can get work done elsewhere.
After the call I emailed him saying do not ever call my phone with threatening, intimidating language and blackmail again or I will take steps to report harassment.

My plan after laser is to get it reworked by paul Clark
 
R

reddwarf

member
Likes
10
#16
Been following this with great interest. The pigments look to have lightened a lot after the laser sessions. Has this Paul Clark guy seen your head yet or are you waiting until it's gone before contacting him?

Good luck
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#17
Yup fading has started. It's going to be a process but I have a rework team around me. I've agreed a treatment plan with Paul Clark at Brandwood clinic and I've one of the best laser techs around in Carl Barton in the UK. Hoping one more laser session will do it. Max 2. But let's see...

I also have 2100 Fue at frontal area performed by Dr Feriduni in 2013. Diffused hair on top and crown. So when SMP done properly, it should be well worth the journey I'm currently on to get where i want to be.

Even without FUE, say an NW7 guy could achieve amazing results with SMP due to the evolution of SMP with a 3d effect, totally natural results. Practitioners like Paul Clark (UK) and Jonathan Gerow (USA) only do natural looking procedures and refuse to do the goofy hairlines that made the SMP industry look bad all those years ago. Some of the SMP results by pracs like the ones I mentioned are mind blowing. The ink has evolved, pracs are now using 100% vegan inks designed solely for smp.
 
R

reddwarf

member
Likes
10
#18
Did you end up getting any financial help towards fixing this from HIS? Must be frustrating having to effectively pay for the same treatment twice. How many days can you get away with between shaves if you have the FUE at the front?
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#19
@reddrawf Absolutely none.

I complained and had to push HIS HAIR hard for a meeting with their CEO. So when I saw him, he said there was nothing wrong with the dots on my head, and that it was my fault for going too dark. I said I did not ask for it to be THAT dark at all! And I asked for it to match my hair colour. Anyway, he refused a refund and asked for £1000 for 2 sessions to fix it and free laser.

So I went to a laser session with their 'sister company' basically their laser tech used to do smp for HIS and the laser room is in the HIS building, that does SMP. All they've done is say the laser company is apparently separate but they had no problem offering me free laser plus I booked the laser session through HIS phone number and then got an email with different company letter heading by 'the laser clinic'

This laser session produced no fading. I waited 9 weeks for a sign of fading. None. The laser used was a cheap portable Chinese 1064 ndyag with a huge gun. The guy was lasering my head for 2 hours. A full scalp laser session should take 30 minutes on average.

Since then I've written formal letters complaining and also told my story online, to get support and advice, plus to warn others about this company. I have had a significant number of people PM me to say they also got SMP at HIS and have botched blue scalp procedure. Most are suffering in silence, some depressed etc.

Then I got a call from the CEO. He had obviously seen that my story online on several platforms, had gained momentum, especially on social media. I literally had 100 SMP clinics on my friends list within half a day or so, and message after message of support. Plus HIS are massively frowned upon as a smear on the SMP industry. That much is certainly clear.

So back to the CEO's phone call. He was swearing/cursing every other word. He kept going on about how he trained all those ******* who then betrayed him and stole from him. He was naming practically every SMP provider. And kept saying how he is the best in the world. He blackmailed me, offering free SMP if I took my story down off the internet. He threatened to blame his freelancers for the bad job I had done and said HIS were not responsible. Dude are you serious? Whether they were freelance or not the procedure took place in HIS clinic with HIS tools and HIS ink by people wearing HIS branded T shirts. He just kept threatening to go online and blame the practitioner who done my SMP, and 'finish him off' as that practitioner has left HIS and opened his own SMP business. I said if no refund I will now terminate this call and write to him.

So I wrote a formal letter to him. I said I wish no telephone contact with him due to being intimidated, blackmailed, threatened to be falsely blamed online, bullied and so on. I again explained that the SMP and laser were both botched and I gave my bank details for a refund otherwise I'll take legal action.

So that's where we are at. When questioned about what his ink contains he got defensive, saying due to health and safety he cannot say what it contains, and that he gets it in batches from the USA and it's FDA approved.

With smp I buzz my hair twice a week with a Barbour clipper, no guard. I still have some hair on top but diffuse thinning and crown loss.
 
B

Bustamove

member
Likes
1
#20
2 weeks after 1st laser session with Alex trivantage 755 wavelength. It's a process but some fading has started in areas. Fading usually kicks in 4-6 weeks after laser session. I'm with a very reputable laser clinic now who specialize in removing SMP
 

Attachments