Donor Scarring

[Prohairclinic]

If you care to see a donor area video after 4400 grafts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xL4sLe_N_MA&list=UUaLOOhF6Uh2wCIfIrm4XaVA&index=6

 

[SADbutTRUE]

beverotti thats a impressive case 4400 grafts fue, donor area looks great, how was the growth , do you have any preop, and full grown pic of the recepient area,, on this case. was it in a few days , or longer?

 

[diamond8]

Yes this is FUE done properly and leaves the Donor area clean and no disfigurement. Nice Work!

 

[pvtpoint2010]

SadButTrue Most Dr's in general hate to be second guessed especially if too many questions are asked.....Most clinics think its there way or the highway

this is true for several Top Doc's as well.......In my case I wanted FUE from a local Dr but was told NO due to the fact I already have strip scars, another told me both scars were in the wrong position and wanted to make a third scar I said no so he said he couldn't help me, another told me it was FUE or nothing...........hence Cole's white dots....Cole however does do great hairline work ....I would go back again if I cant seem to get a competent strip doc to work with what I have....

 

[SADbutTRUE]

thanks for responding pvtpoint is there any way to revise one scar then take the strip from the other scar. so at the end you will wind up with one scar, do diff docs take donor from different areas , hence the scars in two different areas? i always thought the second strip was taken where the first one is, if your having another procedure.wish you success in finding a solution . maybe having temp,smp in one scar and the strip can be taken from the other scar, just thinking outloud,i dont know which would be the best course of action, some of the top strip docs i can think of are SMG, hasson and wong, dr.rahal, dr,gabieral, and dr,wolf, im not sure if dr,wolf is active , you dont hear much from him on the web

 

[pvtpoint2010]

My case is a little different then most as I had 2 strips taken from 2 not so great docs back in 1997 and 2001 in NY

The first Doc took the strip too high for most and the other didn't want to go near it so he went as low as he could go.... AND all that for ONLY 750 GRAFTS in total..!!...250 mini plug things done by Hitzig's office ( WHICH HE'S STILL DOES IN 2013 by the way ..!!) and 550 mini micros done by another doc. the 250 gave me very bad pitting and bumps in my front 1/3 .....That's what im still trying to fix/cover 15 years later..!!

For the most part its still just the front third that needs to be addressed

Also I've been on Proscar for about 7 years with good results then switched to generic ......i lost most ground in that 14 month period ..about a year or so ago i switched back to non generic proscar and started to see some areas fill in again ...but by now its at its best with the meds so its time to go in for another round...and hopefully my last.....

I only need after 5 different top doc consults 1200-1800 grafts ...except for Dr Hasson....he said 2000-3000..!.... all others think he's crazy though ..lol....So I'm guessing 1200-1500 is the proper range of grafts that needs to be placed into zone 1, 2 and a few into 3 to thicken things up.

Hasson and the rest did think I have about 5500-6000 grafts remaining in my donor area .....

 

[SADbutTRUE]

goodluck in your journey , despite having two scars , you have alot of grafts left in the donor, how long do you have to keep your hair to hide scars, what doc are you leaning torwards, keep us posted, im not sure , but didnt you have acell in donor? maybe im thinking about different guy.

 

[Prohairclinic]

SadbutTrue,
here you go bud, same guy with 4400 FUE grafts

[flash=425,344]http://www.youtube.com/v/YeZvOpdbLyI&list=UUaLOOhF6Uh2wCIfIrm4XaVA&index=9&hl=en&fs=1[/flash]

 

[Boberto]

that is nice work Bverotti and typical of quality FUE performed these days

 

[SADbutTRUE]

bverotti thnks for showing result, very impresive, i take my cap off for that one, AND im always wearing my caP ,LOL,

 

[janna]

.9mm punches were used on him. The pic was taken about a year after his procedure. I can't recall how many grafts he said he had but roughly around 2000? The white dots don't typically appear until patients are at about 3 to 4 months after surgery.

 

[janna]

I am not knocking FUE procedures. And, as I stated before that this is not a FUE vs Strip thread. I think they both have it's place in restoring hair to patients. There are positive and negatives to both procedures and patients need to be aware of it before they jump in to either one.

In respect to scarring in that FUE donor patient I posted, much of the scarring is due to the patient's physiology since .9mm punch isn't very large. I don't think a .8mm could have produced a much of a difference as I've seen white dotting on patients who had .7mm and .8mm punches used on them.

I was out in California last week, I saw a patient who had 3700 grafts with a 1mm punch (Artas). You couldn't detect any white scarring but he was only 8 weeks post op. Will it continue to look that way after 3-6 months post op? Time will tell.

 

[hairtech]

I will be open here in saying that we have seen 1 or 2 unusual FUE scarring or poor growth events out of all of our FUE cases over the past 4 years. That one Janna posted above being one of them. Another one was a large FUE case that had some growth problems however he came back and we corrected it.

Which brings up another point for the readers out there. In this industry nothing is 100% obviously, but another thing to look at is how a clinic takes care of a person when such things arise. All of the top HT clinics take care of their patients when poor growth, large strip scars, and even a simple hairline correction happen.

I have heard of such things as, "It's your fault." coming from a clinic and what a poster above said when he felt that he might "know" too much about a procedure thus making the surgeon upset... is all unacceptable.

 

[pvtpoint2010]

Hairtech

I though I was making a well informed decision back at the start of my HT journey

So the wishing I know then what I know now syndrome has give me a big list of Patient to Dr questions. At this point I feel I know somewhat about the industry' standards.

Many Dr's IMO feel patients knowing too much is a hindrance to there practice as they have there own way of doing there practice. If a patient has his own views on the way his case should go most Dr's role there eyes and say ....Sorry this is what I think and if its not what your looking for HAVE A GOOD DAY.

This I'm the Dr on the white horse" approach is what caused most of the industry atrocities over the years....

Again this is just my 15 year experience opinion

 

[pvtpoint2010]

Ok since were some what on the " WHITE DOT" topic Dr Cole feels his ACELL/PRP treatment is astounding regarding white dot scaring....

When I was in his office about 2.5 years ago I told him about my research regarding ACELL's treatments before he started using it. He said he was just monitoring its clinical results at that time.

About 6-8 months later he started to offer it in his practice along with PRP in a single product. Now I've seen in my ACELL testing that its results were very minimal at best.

I had a small treatment into my scar and a few white dots with Dr Cooley ( Hair multiplication/plucking) Dr Bernstein in NY couldn't see any change ....

So I'm not sure if Coles results are accurate or not....Since id rather not shave my donor due to existing scars I feel 1200-1500 grafts with unshaven FUE is a better option then extending one of the scars I already have...

However since I already have multiple whit dots I'm leery of progressing with this method as well unless the ACELL/PRP has an actual positive effect..

What's your opinion Janna/hairtech?

BTW If I wanted to go the strip rout Dr Ron is my first choice...I also just tried to make an in person trip to Your office for an in person consult next month Janna but he wont be available around the time I could come.

If he felt I could get close to the needed grafts with the upper scar strip without causing too much tension It consider that route too....

 

[pvtpoint2010]

Extreamly interesting...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khVm4wSpzjo

The only question I have is:

Why dont they give extra ACELL for postop application?


On the ACELL website everyone who regenerated tissue applied ACELL daily for up to several days/weeks (depending on the injury/wanted outcome)

So why not extraction sites..!

 

[Iniesta]

Both FUT and FUE obviously can make harm but also can leave almost no sign of surgery in the donor area. Thus far I guess we all agree.

A skilled Dr could probably harvest thousands of grafts via FUE without over harvesting and the donor would look good for many years. But how will it look when the patient turns 60 or 70? I have seen many old men in my home town with a NW6-pattern and extremly thin donor hair. Looks like 30-40 grafts / cm2. I bet these men had a fairly OK donor in their mid 20s. How the hell will peoples donor look like if they are destined to be a NW6 with very thin donor when they have had surgery where thousands of FUE have been removed? And what about their recipient? OK, I know that it is more common of course to have a reasonable donor when you are 60, 70 years old, but the donor-thing is more common than the HT-clinic want to tell all the young lads out there. Also, it frightens me when I see top clinics harvesting FUE-grafts from a NW5-pattern. HOW can a clinic know call that the "safe zone"?

Probably a FUT-scar (a good one) also would be visible if you will be affected by severe donor thinning, but IMO it would look worse if you would have had many, many grafts removed via FUE.

 

[Optimist]

Pvt,

Have you seen Dr. Cooley's recent presentation about his results with Acell, plucking and PRP? I believe he indicated plucking did not work very well with scars, which would explain your poor result. He said it worked best when they were placed near transplanted hair.

Use of Acell in donor sites really seems to be gaining in popularity. Dr. Cole claims he sees 10 to 70 percent regeneration.

 

[topccat29]

Optimist with 70% regeneration how long would it take to bring a NW6 back to a NW1? Do you have these pictures you can post or something close? Have you had these procedure and experienced the regeneration yourself?

Do you have the pictures of the good result with plucking?

 

[Optimist]

topcat,

I have absolutely no proof regarding donor regeneration. I am just reporting what Dr. Cole has been stating recently. I believe he is now stating that they are seeing around 50% regeneration on average. I asked his employee, Chuck, to post pictures showing the regeneration and I hope to get a response. I think they should be able to provide this if they are consistently seeing regeneration.

Dr. Cooley and Dr. Cole have been experimenting with Acell and seem to be reaching different conclusions. Dr. Cooley reported he did not see donor regrowth with Acell, but that it helps with healing. Dr. Cooley also reports success with plucking when the plucked grafts are placed near transplanted hair. Several months back Dr. Cooley posted a presentation showing before and after pictures with plucked grafts. He also showed results from Acell + PRP as a stand alone treatment and other experiments he has been doing.

I think the growing consensus is that Acell is beneficial with donor healing and it seems more and more doctors are using it. But Dr. Cole is the only one I know of who claims to see regeneration.

I remain skeptical of all advances until they are proven with more than anecdotal evidence. However, I welcome any attempts to move things forward and am hopeful that they are onto something.