Do better doctors generally use less grafts?

[Bigmac]

The strategically placed transplant would be an area of my head (the front) predominantly of transplanted hair so the further hairloss would then be that which occurs behind?

Have a read of this thread.

What happens when the lateral hump area drops?

Even when the hair loss pattern has become better known some clinics make the mistake of transplanting thin coverage all over the top of the head which looks ridiculous when the lateral humps drop. You can have thin coverage you just cannot have it in the lateral hump area. That area needs to...

www.hairlossexperiences.com

 

[El Chacal]

Having seen the threads of Jester RIP, I went to the center he documents in his videos in London for a consultation and to see a clinic live.

Nothing unexpected, except the price they quoted at the end - very attractive, thought i misheard at first. Less than half what I have in mind with doctor ive been in contact with up to now- in Poland.

Its a dilema. Jester seems to have had a great result. So I could have my cake and eat it. Pay a fraction of what I expected and get a good result.

But i know there have also been criticisms of this place, not necessarily even just the results but the marketing. .

Trying to think rationally and trying to apply what ive read on forums to my decision, im thinking maybe its safer to go with an established name? At this centre you get to choose which doctor, but none of them have a in depth online palmares the way the doctors whos names one can see at the bottom of the page do.

Even though the price is good I dont want to risk losing 3000 grafts if it goes bad, then I will only have 3000 left to fix and for any future surgeries.
If by going to the doctor that gets good reviews, I am essentially paying to increase the probability that the surgery will go well then im willing to empty my pocket. Is that an accurate way to see it - a more established doctor means a bigger chance it will go right?

Just posting out loud, In case anyone has a similar dilema, or can comment on whether im thinking on the right lines.

 

[Ronnie]

Hi

Not sure if you’ve read my post on the previous page, but these are my concerns too.

Probably the only way to get your head around clinics/surgeons is to research them to death, the more you read of others experiences, the better idea you’ll get of how much you can trust them.

This is pretty much what I did and gave me a very strong impression that you are stacking the odds in your favour if you go to a reputable clinic/surgeon. The list I came up with of those I felt I could have the utmost confidence in were all at the more expensive end of the scale. I can think of a few off the top of my head where I’ve only read very positive feedback, literally not read any disappointments or horror stories. The much cheaper places, I’ve read a lot of mixed reviews, it seems to be more of a lottery. There have definitely been lots of people with great results who didn’t pay a fortune, but enough horror stories to make me wary too.

The way I chose to think about it is, if I were to go shopping for a new car, say a Ford Mondeo, would I buy the bottom of the range model? The answer is definitely not and I’d likely spend £5k-£10k more for something in the middle of the range. Given how much it means to have hair back, the artistry involves in rearranging the same amount of hair I currently have into something that gives the illusion of not being bald and the fact that you have a limited amount of donor hair available, why would I seek out the cheapest option to perform this operation for me? I’m hoping to find the person to offer me the best guidance throughout the process. (which may involve planning for future surgeries too), who has exceptional surgical skills and also exceptional artistic skills to create my head of hair. Am I likely to find that by just going for the cheapest option? The answer is likely impacted by the job in hand, I have a lot of balding to cover so it needs a real pro on the job, if I was just filling in a tiny area, I’d be more inclined to trust the job to someone cheaper.

This is just the way I look at it anyway, hope that helps.

 

[Bigmac]

Having seen the threads of Jester RIP, I went to the center he documents in his videos in London for a consultation and to see a clinic live.

Nothing unexpected, except the price they quoted at the end - very attractive, thought i misheard at first. Less than half what I have in mind with doctor ive been in contact with up to now- in Poland.

Its a dilema. Jester seems to have had a great result. So I could have my cake and eat it. Pay a fraction of what I expected and get a good result.

But i know there have also been criticisms of this place, not necessarily even just the results but the marketing. .

Trying to think rationally and trying to apply what ive read on forums to my decision, im thinking maybe its safer to go with an established name? At this centre you get to choose which doctor, but none of them have a in depth online palmares the way the doctors whos names one can see at the bottom of the page do.

Even though the price is good I dont want to risk losing 3000 grafts if it goes bad, then I will only have 3000 left to fix and for any future surgeries.
If by going to the doctor that gets good reviews, I am essentially paying to increase the probability that the surgery will go well then im willing to empty my pocket. Is that an accurate way to see it - a more established doctor means a bigger chance it will go right?

Just posting out loud, In case anyone has a similar dilema, or can comment on whether im thinking on the right lines.

It’s important to do plenty of research. Jesters result does look promising.
The organization he booked with hire doctors in, there’s a good chance they hire in freelance techs as well. Something for you to ask.
Will you get the same techs that Jester had?
Take your time and don’t rush into anything. Grafts and a good result are more important than saving a few pounds/euros.

 

[El Chacal]

Ive decided to go with a doctor Saifi in Poland. This was the doctor I referenced quoting 2400 grafts vs the general 4500 I got from Turkish clinics and high graft totals ive seen in operatons from friends.

My rough decision making went as follows.

1 Quality. What I can see (good but other doctors also seem good) and what others think - general online imprression.
All the threads ive seen on his operations receive thumbs up from the OP and generally thumbs up from subcommenters. Going back years. The general gist of those who heard of him is "i heard good things". I also sometimes see the name on lists of the higher tier specialists, made by people who like to rank these things like sports players.

2 Logistics
Less important than quality but if having to choose between 2 doctors with good ratings the fact that this is an easier location for me does play a big part.

3 Availability. Again, after quality, but the fact that there was an availability within 3 months whereas others have year long waiting lists also played a role I have to admit. Is it a rookie mistake that I would like it done sooner and not wait longer to gather more info?

4 Cost, to some extent. Of course Im going for mid price range so paying significantly more than with some doctors and potentially some good ones, but still more within budget than some of the big names.

5 Saving on grafts.
a) It lets me keep some grafts for potential future operations if necessary. Not the draining the whole thing at once.
b) I also have the feeling, as this thread has touched on, that if the doctor can get a good result using half the grafts of others, then that is a sign of quality vs we got a good result because we used all your grafts.

Is my line of thinking good? Also any familiarity with this doctor - are the good opinions justified?

 

[loui]

Ive decided to go with a doctor Saifi in Poland. This was the doctor I referenced quoting 2400 grafts vs the general 4500 I got from Turkish clinics and high graft totals ive seen in operatons from friends.

My rough decision making went as follows.

1 Quality. What I can see (good but other doctors also seem good) and what others think - general online imprression.
All the threads ive seen on his operations receive thumbs up from the OP and generally thumbs up from subcommenters. Going back years. The general gist of those who heard of him is "i heard good things". I also sometimes see the name on lists of the higher tier specialists, made by people who like to rank these things like sports players.

2 Logistics
Less important than quality but if having to choose between 2 doctors with good ratings the fact that this is an easier location for me does play a big part.

3 Availability. Again, after quality, but the fact that there was an availability within 3 months whereas others have year long waiting lists also played a role I have to admit. Is it a rookie mistake that I would like it done sooner and not wait longer to gather more info?

4 Cost, to some extent. Of course Im going for mid price range so paying significantly more than with some doctors and potentially some good ones, but still more within budget than some of the big names.

5 Saving on grafts.
a) It lets me keep some grafts for potential future operations if necessary. Not the draining the whole thing at once.
b) I also have the feeling, as this thread has touched on, that if the doctor can get a good result using half the grafts of others, then that is a sign of quality vs we got a good result because we used all your grafts.

Is my line of thinking good? Also any familiarity with this doctor - are the good opinions justified?

Dr Saifi is good, but he is usually very conservative, some think he is too conservative, he usually says 2000 grafts when almost everyone says 3000(including the best clinics in Europe).

 

[Bigmac]

I’ve seen decent results from Dr Saifi. I think your options are justified. Time wise, having a long waiting list is good for the clinic but doesn’t necessarily mean they’re producing great work. It’s usually a good indicator but further research is required to establish their credentials. I know of clinics that only work 2 or 3 days per week doing surgery, their choice. They are booked up 6 months plus but if they did it every day, this would halve.

What is the surgical plan Dr Saifi recommends? 2400 grafts used well could give you a good illusion of density.

 

[El Chacal]

Dr Saifi is good, but he is usually very conservative, some think he is too conservative, he usually says 2000 grafts when almost everyone says 3000(including the best clinics in Europe).

Thanks for the advice. Indeed that would fall in line with what led me to ask the title question of the thread.

So what are the implications of this. Might not get full coverage? Or might need a follow up operation sooner than with others?
Wouldn't that have impacted the reviews and general good opinion that exists of him?

 

[El Chacal]

I’ve seen decent results from Dr Saifi. I think your options are justified. Time wise, having a long waiting list is good for the clinic but doesn’t necessarily mean they’re producing great work. It’s usually a good indicator but further research is required to establish their credentials. I know of clinics that only work 2 or 3 days per week doing surgery, their choice. They are booked up 6 months plus but if they did it every day, this would halve.

What is the surgical plan Dr Saifi recommends? 2400 grafts used well could give you a good illusion of density.

Ive been in touch by email so received a brief answer on this. He wrote that 2400 is not a lower number but the number I need and that the focus will be on the frontal area.

 

[loui]

Thanks for the advice. Indeed that would fall in line with what led me to ask the title question of the thread.

So what are the implications of this. Might not get full coverage? Or might need a follow up operation sooner than with others?
Wouldn't that have impacted the reviews and general good opinion that exists of him?

Have you had a consultation with other good Drs? Like Dr Bicer, Dr Lupanzula, Dr Feriduni, Dr Bisanga? See what they say about your frontal third if thats what you want to focus now. From my experience to get good coverage there you need somewhere around 3500 or so.

Not sure if Saifi means just front part 2000, then he wants to do mid part by itself, then crown part while other Drs may want to do frontal third, then only crown part.

 

[Bigmac]

Ive been in touch by email so received a brief answer on this. He wrote that 2400 is not a lower number but the number I need and that the focus will be on the frontal area.

I would definitely have him put it in writing with a diagram explaining exactly where he will put these grafts and at what density. Be 100% sure before having surgery. Ask if he has similar examples to yourself you can view or speak with.
What are your expectations? What would you be happy with?

 

[El Chacal]

Have you had a consultation with other good Drs? Like Dr Bicer, Dr Lupanzula, Dr Feriduni, Dr Bisanga? See what they say about your frontal third if thats what you want to focus now. From my experience to get good coverage there you need somewhere around 3500 or so.

Not sure if Saifi means just front part 2000, then he wants to do mid part by itself, then crown part while other Drs may want to do frontal third, then only crown part.

I did not have consultations with those doctors. The latter 3 seem a little outside of my price range. Also on the logistics front I'm wary of both countries (Belgium and Turkey) due to the changing travel rules still in these times. Which is why I put down logistics as decision point 2. For me Saifi was a good fit as I have close contacts in Poland that I could visit and quarantine if need be.

My thinking is also that if he goes for too little grafts, there wouldnt be anything stopping me going for more with him someone else later to fill in? As long as he doesn't botch it it would be a question of being able to top up later if need be?

 

[loui]

I did not have consultations with those doctors. The latter 3 seem a little outside of my price range. Also on the logistics front I'm wary of both countries (Belgium and Turkey) due to the changing travel rules still in these times. Which is why I put down logistics as decision point 2. For me Saifi was a good fit as I have close contacts in Poland that I could visit and quarantine if need be.

My thinking is also that if he goes for too little grafts, there wouldnt be anything stopping me going for more with him someone else later to fill in? As long as he doesn't botch it it would be a question of being able to top up later if need be?

Yes ofcourse, it depends how many surgeries you want.

Everything I have seen from Dr Saifi is good, so no doubt he is a good Dr.

You are a typical Norwood 5A which means you will need somewhere 5500-7000 grafts to have the balding area totally filled, if everything goes well in the surgeries and typical 90-95% survive rate. 2000 grafts will do the front, 3500 will get the frontal third.

If I were to decide for myself I would do a two-step approach, going for the frontal third in 1 surgery and then try to cover the crown area with 1 surgery.

 

[El Chacal]

Yes ofcourse, it depends how many surgeries you want.

Everything I have seen from Dr Saifi is good, so no doubt he is a good Dr.

You are a typical Norwood 5A which means you will need somewhere 5500-7000 grafts to have the balding area totally filled, if everything goes well in the surgeries and typical 90-95% survive rate. 2000 grafts will do the front, 3500 will get the frontal third.

If I were to decide for myself I would do a two-step approach, going for the frontal third in 1 surgery and then try to cover the crown area with 1 surgery.

Thanks for the advice.
I'm ok with doing a second down the line.

I'll see what the Doctor can do with the Front, hopefully moving into the frontal third.

As Ive never tried fin before and have now discovered the topical version, I'm hoping maybe that will also be able to improve my situation a little bit, together with the transplant, make it better at least and then potentially do more down the line.

 

[El Chacal]

I would definitely have him put it in writing with a diagram explaining exactly where he will put these grafts and at what density. Be 100% sure before having surgery. Ask if he has similar examples to yourself you can view or speak with.
What are your expectations? What would you be happy with?

I think I'd be happy with a good improvement.

Having enough on the front that I can mask some of the stuff behind with stuff like topic, or maybe fin or maybe just growing it out longer wont look as ridiculous as it does now.

And to be in a position where a potential second surgery could really fill me in nicely.

I am also seeing it not just as what can a surgery to for me but what can a surgery + treatments do for me.

The doctor made that point from the start, that I need treatments as well. His suggestions were.

1 PRP (unsure)
2 Laser comb (also unsure)
3 Tablets and shampoo from a company called CR Labs. I did find one testimony of a surgery from this doctor where the guy showed insane improvements on these tablets. But I'm hesitant to take them without knowing what's in them.
4 Minoxidil - He said to stop 10 days before the surgery and for 3 weeks after, so I dont see the point to start now, then stop for a month and start again. Would rather start a month after. Also wondering if I should start min and fin at the same time or see how one works before the other.
5 Fin- I do want to start on topical finasteride as I mentioned before. But I know there can be shedding in the first few months on fin. As i'm already booked in for the surgery, is there a risk starting fin now could weaken the donor area for the surgery. Or if not the donor area, weaken further how I look on the day of the operation and therefore offset the plan on the day of the surgery?
Or am I overthinking it and should start fin now?

 

[Bigmac]

PRP may or may not work. As a long term treatment I don’t think it would be viable.

Laser combs have the possibility to make improvement. I don't see any harm in using one providing you’re not paying thousands for one.

Not heard of CR labs. Shampoo will not prevent hair loss. I’ll have a read of their site to see what claims they make.

Finasteride and minoxidil are available as one topical application. I would research into the various options available. Starting treatments, I would stick to what your doctor advises.

 

[sonakshisharma569]

Impressive Post. This is really useful information.

 

[El Chacal]

So I went and got it. Just the 2000 for now but hope to see if this will help a bit and potentially reassess next year if going for more.
Did not start on topical fin and min yet due to the operation but will start soon. Only worry is I was interested to see what the hair results were and then fin so that I could compare the 2 but I guess that's just one of those sacrifices.
Pictures are an hour after the op, 5 days after and the last one 10 days after.

Is it possible to see already from the early pics how it might end up?

 

[Philw]

My opinion go on meds for 1yr see how u get on
Concentrate on front first with a hair transplant getting a matuer softer hairline
Then after trying meds to thicken everything ie crown maybe have a small op over the crown
Good luck with u result

 

[Ronnie]

So how was your experience with Dr Saifi overall? I’m starting to given great consideration to him, I think a conservative approach which favours fewer grafts and gives greater options in the future might be just what’s required for me. His price seems decent too.